Microsoft I'm going off you....

[kobejonez]

*Rant mode engaged* So I'm paying a subscription fee for online play when GAMESPY and apps like it give you this for free. And instead of widening the gap between Gold/silver members MS have been closing it. And now theres the PSN and they should also be pushing the benefits of a subscription service over the free competition. They have cut the benefits of Gold but the frankly high sub fee remains the same.
I'm growing steadily sick of M$ and their "f*ck consumers in the ass" approach to the 360(and yes in general). I have had dealings with customer support, I have been paying premium prices, I have been noticing the 360 weaknesses and I'm not the only one. I have also noticed that M$ are doing sweet F.A to address these concerns(OK the 3RL warranty update is good but almost too little too late.)
Add to that the rampant cheating on XBL that goes as far I can see unchallenged, the continued support of the Core skew despite being obsolete for a year, An over zealous, creatively hampering and ineffective game finishing/release(i forget the correct term) process, etc(in place of "I could go on"). Sorry if this bums anyone out, not my intention. Just saying what I see.
Anyone have a equally realistic, more positive view of XBOX's future they can share?
Oh and my beef is with MS not my beloved 360 btw.

[UKJAY]

I agree that paying for 'Live' should be scrapped. Or if not 'Live' the price of crap content should be free...by that I mean themes, gamerpics which are all in general adverts for games. I think to charge for a 64x64pixel gamerpic which displays game characters or content which can be seen to be advertising a game or showing support for it...is an outrage!!

[Thryon]

I posted my reply to your rant in the other thread already.

I do agree with Jay, Gold members should get something extra for paying, even if its only gamerpics or themes.

[kobejonez]

I won't quote but you're both right. Although these ideas are only a few steps in the right direction they are just steps, little bits of what should make up being a Gold member. M$ should(as I said before) be setting subscribers apart from Silver members(and the PSN for that matter) by offering a lot more than online play for your fee. Or scrap gold membership entirely. Thyron if you haven't had many problems thats awesome and long may it continue, but there are lots of us who have been messed around by MSCS and its very frustrating if like me your problem was simple, uncomplex and should of been sorted right away. Now as you all may or may not know I have been a big fan of Xbox and M$ since the original, and I've got to the point I'm at now through actions taken by M$. I haven't just decided to hate on M$ all of a sudden, and there has been no single incident, its a growing list of stuff . I feel that to some extent I'm over reacting or reacting too soon. But enough has happened for me to be concerned and want to share my concerns with other Xbots to see if they feel the same(This isn't a M$/360 flame request/thread BTW!!) and what if anything can/will be done by M$/Us to ease/help the situation.

[Thryon]

I do agree that MS has lost a great oppertunity to expand their dominace in the next-gen market by having all these problems. I get people asking all the time if my consoles have died. That is the perception of the Xbox 360, highly unreliable. If anything, Xbox 360 fans have been forgiving because of the amazing games that are being released or will soon be released on this console. All is not lost as you indicated. MS can and should redeem themselves for past mistakes, and reward those that have stuck with them through tough times. The biggest mistake in my opinion from MS is not charging for Live, or for releasing a product that could have used a few more months of testing, I can live with those slight problems, but thier biggest mistake is outsourcing their help desk to people who do not care about the product and offer very poor service. As an IT person, I have dealt with MS in the past on server problems, and I can guarantee you that the service is the best you can get. They are quick, knowledgeable and very friendly.

Enough ranting. I must sleep now.

[wakeboardnmoto]

ya i agree that most of the marketplace is advertisements that cost money. i think that the silver membership should be plain and simple free online multiplayer, nothing more nothing less, and gold should include perks for its 50 dollars meaning free maps for games, pics, themes, all that shit, it would make perfect sense to the average joe, but to a money hungry corporation it seems absurd. we gotta stick it to the man, (im just not exactly sure how yet) 8) .

[Oscar]

Hmmm let me see.............. Like Microstuffed dont already make a big enough mark up on the games, consoles, controllers etc?! Would it kill them to give everyone free membership to live and content to those willing to pay for the privelage (you cant call it free content when you have to pay to get there in the first place)? I'm starting to think for ever $100 Bill Gates makes $1 should be rolled up and stuffed up his arse sideways.. He might think twice about sensless money grabbing? Or he might like it? Its worth a try?? ;)

[kobejonez]

And Yay the masses complained and the Corporate monolith responded.
http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=6823&Itemid=2
And the masses rejoiced but it was short lived, for tho the monolith giveth so shall the monolith taketh with announcement that the XBLA cap stayeth the same at 150 of the lords Megabytes. here endeth the lesson. Amen.

[TRIGGER M4N]

On the upside, MS announed XBLSP.

[YoinkIRL]

I hate the be a fanboy, but I calls em as I sees em, and to me... Microsoft has been doing a ridiculously great job this generation.

I have a launch console and haven't really had any gripes at all since I've got it. I don't mind paying for a superior service and my downloads are always fast. I don't download movies or buy off XBLA but it's nice to know theres always good arcade games I can grab for a couple bucks.

Customer service has always been quick and knowledgable whenever I needed them.

I don't really see what your ranting about other than subscription service and Gold members losing their privledges. Microsoft can never make people happy simply because people don't understand how business works. Like all the people crying about HDMI being added. They were the ones crying about how it wasn't included and when it finally came, they cried about how the original console they paid for did not magically transform into a HDMI one.

If Microsoft said that Gold Membership was removed, and that Xbox Live was now free: all the people who bought 12 month memberships in the last 2-3 months would be crying about how they wasted their money. Which is absolutely ridiculous.

I don't see why they should have to offer more than online play for your fee. Alot of games are simply 2 different games, one single player and one online. An example of this would be Splinter Cell: Double Agent. It's simply a different game online and is a huge incentive to go gold. Online play is very important in itself and paying 50$ for flawless online play doesn't bother me.

Maybe I'm just lucky and that's why I have such a positive view of Microsoft this time around. My console hasn't shown the slightest sign of breakdown, I love the games I play on it, flawless downloads and no-lag multiplayer, and I have yet to see a cheater or glitcher on any multiplayer game (and I play them alot). And for the people who do have problems, they even took a huge hit to correct their console mistake. Also the things going on with XNA continue to impress me.

It just seems Microsoft has had a strong showing (Note, they could have DESTROYED sony if they had done a COUPLE things differently), but no matter what they do they will never make everyone happy.... because of course they are Microsoft.

I, for one, am completely happy with my 360 and it's services. Actually I'd say I'm more than happy. It's the best console I have owned hands down.

[mass9]

I'm starting to think for ever $100 Bill Gates makes $1 should be rolled up and stuffed up his arse sideways.. He might think twice about sensless money grabbing? Or he might like it? Its worth a try?? ;)


Now come on.....
http://www.gatesfoundation.org/Grants/
You can't say that the man isn't a philanthropist. That's over $13 Billion in grants for 2007 alone.

I would love if Live was made free (and I do believe that at some point it will be) but since the status quo has already been set at $50/annum and we pay it, I don't expect the change any time soon.

Perhaps the next-gen will have free multiplayer access?
A man can dream, can't he?

[UKJAY]

I've still not been refunded yet for paying to get my console repaired before the 3 yr warranty announcement came in...anyone know when they're rolling it out?

[kobejonez]

YoinkIRL Now don't get me wrong I love my 360 and its right up there with the Dreamcast for greatness. My console is also from launch and apart from odd freeze its been rock solid, my dealings with customer support was to do with my XBL account and thankfully not my box. I just don't want to see M$ drop the ball and ruin a great product through bad decisions.I'm not a fanboy just a concerned citizen. :D

[Nekro Neko]

I think Gold Members should be given a discount on the marketplace. I dunno, maybe 10% on XBLA games, 20% on DLC and 50% on Gamerpics and Themes (Although they should be free).

[Thryon]

I think Gold Members should be given a discount on the marketplace. I dunno, maybe 10% on XBLA games, 20% on DLC and 50% on Gamerpics and Themes (Although they should be free).

WOW. that is the best idea so far. That way no silver member could cry foul, or scream that MS is now charging for demo. Gold and Silver would all get the same content, but Gold would get it cheaper.

For your great idea, I shall now grant you the first XBL no-prize. :)

[wakeboardnmoto]

I think Gold Members should be given a discount on the marketplace. I dunno, maybe 10% on XBLA games, 20% on DLC and 50% on Gamerpics and Themes (Although they should be free).

ive been thinking of similar ideas as well, i thought it would be cool if they would put things on sale like ALL other stores do, i mean theyre a store and they have old and out dated stuff why not lower its price? (only to gold members of course 8) )

[VVV Lightning]

Yeah i'm sick of M$ I do love the 360 though, but there service is going the wrong way, if you have silver then the marketplace should be as it is now but if you have gold everything should be free or very very cheap. I don't see where our £40 ($80) a year is going. They say its for the marketplace servers and private and video chat but silver members can use it aswell, so are we paying for them too. People always say PS3 is free which is true for now but they don't have a quarter of as many online users as the 360 does.
Wee need to compromise, either give us gold for free and charge for content or charge us for gold and give us free content.
Im also sick of phoning customer support, half the time I can't even hear them and they don't understand me. They give you a different answer each time you call, and all my M$ S*** keeps breaking down apart from my 360 and they will not do anything, im going round in circles.

[Oscar]

Now come on.....
You can't say that the man isn't a philanthropist. That's over $13 Billion in grants for 2007 alone.

With a $59 billion fortune by my estimate (I'm not great at maffs hence the very rough estimate) He's earning anywhere from $9 - $15 million a day in interest alone. This is also only concentrating on Bill's own personal fortune not M$. So I guess its easy to give it away when youre getting it for free (unlike Live)....

Also.... The Los Angeles Times published a carefully researched article about the conflicts that exist between the Gates Foundation the companies that the foundation invests in and the grants that it makes, particularly in Africa.

They help the people on one hand but pollute their country by funding heavy industry on the other?!

I've always had a beef with M$...... I'm just jealous of the guy I guess?? ;)

[YoinkIRL]

Yeah... because he has so much money his contributions count less. Totally makes sense. Gates has given 8 billion away so far. 60 billion fortune / 8 billion = like 12% of his wealth.

Do you give anywhere NEAR as much? Do you give 12%? Let's say you make 50,000$ a year. I will bet you don't give 5,000$ a year to charity. Maybe 20 bucks here, a couple cents here in the christmas jar. etc etc. He also has the plan set in motion to slowly give away his entire fortune before he dies, leaving his children with a tiny fraction of his money.

But because he's so rich, it doesn't matter. I agree.

[Oscar]

Dont get me wrong I dont think there is no merit to the Gates Foundation.. If it were a country it would be in the top 100 as far as net worth goes so he is giving away a fair bit..... But we do pay for it to begin with by buying his products, and although he's giving away his personal fortune who gets M$.... Not the poor and needy I'm sure?

Also I already pay 23% of my annual salary to the government in Tax and national Insurance so I do give away more than i can afford in my eyes!?
All I want is free Live.... Its not much to ask is it?

I dont want the shirt off the buggers back... Yet ;)

[UKJAY]

Seeing as this is a rant thread...

I hate the bitch that won 35million pounds on the Euro lottery friday. A postal worker on strike too !

[Oscar]

Seeing as this is a rant thread...

I hate the bitch that won 35million pounds on the Euro lottery friday. A postal worker on strike too !

I second that............ Shes from East Kilbride too.... A bloody Weegie!!! :P

[YoinkIRL]

ROFL Did you guys see the other lady?

The lady that bought a lottery ticket with a stolen credit card and she ended up winning but they wouldn't give her the money because the stolen card? Or is that the one? Either way, hilarious.

[UKJAY]

ROFL Did you guys see the other lady?

The lady that bought a lottery ticket with a stolen credit card and she ended up winning but they wouldn't give her the money because the stolen card? Or is that the one? Either way, hilarious.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2007370933,00.html

The hoaxer was a guy

[Praetorian]

Well I see everybodies point here but were forgetting one thing:

Xbox live is kickass. No other service that is free that I know of offers cross game invites, cross game voice chat, IM, video chat and more. Ok people get to game fore free, but I have heard people moan that the PSN is poo compared to Live, and that is just a case of you get what you pay for.

I could be wrong here, and MS have made many mistakes (HDMI should have been there since day one and they should give non HDMI owners a chance to upgrade somehow, RLOD) but I still think MS are doing well. They have a a reasonably cheap console that doesn't cost $800 (£425 = $850) and they dont cram a format we are unsure of down our throats. Sony are good, but both companies need to change tack to really succeed in the market. I just think MS are not doing a bad job. I don't think sony would ever have extended to a 3 year warentee if they had had the same issues hardware wise.

[_Chris_]

Dont get me wrong I dont think there is no merit to the Gates Foundation.. If it were a country it would be in the top 100 as far as net worth goes so he is giving away a fair bit..... But we do pay for it to begin with by buying his products, and although he's giving away his personal fortune who gets M$.... Not the poor and needy I'm sure?

Also I already pay 23% of my annual salary to the government in Tax and national Insurance so I do give away more than i can afford in my eyes!?
All I want is free Live.... Its not much to ask is it?

I dont want the shirt off the buggers back... Yet ;)
Unless (unlikely as it is) he gets a really cool shirt:)

[Chris]

HDMI and included wireless. (and hard drive on every box)

[The_Glovner]

I don't think sony would ever have extended to a 3 year warentee if they had had the same issues hardware wise.

They did have the same issue with the release PS2's, and no extension of warranty was given and you were expected to stump up £70 ($140) to get the issue that was a known fault dealt with.

[Bleach22]

HDMI and included wireless. (and hard drive on every box)

Core doesn't include a hard drive.
No Xbox 360 ships with wireless included in the package, you have to pay £60 for a wireless network adapter.

Your all whining about having to pay £40 per-year for xbox live right? Well dont pay it. Go on PlayStation Network and then see how much you like XBL compared to it. PSN may be free, but to view messages and friends you have to leave a game, you can only play people in the same continent as you (even if you move from Europe to N. America or something, you can still only play with Euro.)

With XBL you get a great setup, Video Chat, Windows Live Messenger, XBL Arcade, Demos, Themes, Gamerpictures, Music, Videos and updated content every 2-3days if not daily. I agree that themes and gamerpictures could be made free, or atleast a very low price. But its M$ what do you expect.
The only bone i have to pick with Microsoft and Xbox Live is how they give the US more than Europe, especially themes and gamerpictures. They give them shitloads of free ones.

[_Chris_]

Core doesn't include a hard drive.


They arnt making HDMI core consoles as far as i'm aware, so Chris' statement is still valid.

[Chris]

Core doesn't include a hard drive.
No Xbox 360 ships with wireless included in the package, you have to pay £60 for a wireless network adapter.


I'm saying that's what Microsoft should've started off with in the first place on 11/22/2005 for every single xbox.

Btw, I have Xbox Live and the PSN network. Everything Playstation is much more stylized and flowy if that makes sense. They do need to redesign their marketplace for damn sure, but for it being free it's great. I also like that I can actually buy games for $2.99 instead of the mindfuck of 250(ish) Microsoft points. MS couldn't even do it the Nintendo way where you do a simple $10 = 1000 points.

Of course Xbox live is better when you're playing a game, but then again it has to since I'm paying $50. (You can't really give them the credit since you have to pay anyway) You also can't give them much credit for having this amazing network, then watching as it crumbles because some popular demo hit. Core gamers know the minute something comes on Xbox live, and Microsoft knows that. PREPARE FOR IT, DUMBASSES. Wow, we put this Bioshock demo up and somehow we couldn't foresee that more than 15 people would be trying to download it at once. What, you didn't notice it all the other times it happened? I realize it's probably much harder than it seems, but Christ....just make an educated guess. If I'm paying for Xbox live that's supposed to be so much better, then make it so much better.

[Bleach22]

You've also got to realize Xbox Live has alot more members on board than Sony or Nintendo so when downloading a popular demo your going to have ALOT. of people downloading it.

EDIT: And you say it's alot better when playing games, well... isn't that the main reason you bought a 360?

[Chris]

EDIT: And you say it's alot better when playing games, well... isn't that the main reason you bought a 360?

don't get me started.

[Bleach22]

What do you mean dont get you started? I think that the main reason anybody would get a games console is to play games, right?

[Chris]

What do you mean dont get you started? I think that the main reason anybody would get a games console is to play games, right?

Ever watched a Movie on your 360? Ever listened to an MP3 maybe? Ever read an Xbox live message that had nothing to do with gaming? Sure, you can claim that the Xbox 360 is a gaming machine only, but watch as I turn my Xbox 360 on. They're advertising for a movie to download? A trailer to see? THAT'S a little odd. Isn't it? For a 'gaming' machine?

No one seems to notice that though. They just notice that the PS3 plays blu-ray. And THAT ISN'T FOR GAMING!!!111

[Bleach22]

Ever watched a Movie on your 360? Ever listened to an MP3 maybe? Ever read an Xbox live message that had nothing to do with gaming? Sure, you can claim that the Xbox 360 is a gaming machine only, but watch as I turn my Xbox 360 on. They're advertising for a movie to download? A trailer to see? THAT'S a little odd. Isn't it? For a 'gaming' machine?

The main function of it is for gaming.
It is a all-round multimedia hub, yes. I stand corrected but what I was saying is the main reason for getting one, and the main use for the 360, is gaming.

[Chris]

And I bought a PS3 for gaming. I can't even take advantage of blu-ray yet. I just think they cleared out these 60 gigs to replace the 599 price point(USD) for the 80 with a game. That's why I bought it when I did. Plus, I've been bitching about wanting a damn Web Browser on my tv so I can get on the forum while I'm on my lazy ass.

[kobejonez]

Well another wasted day waiting for a demo to download.¬_¬ 6k a sec average.
I wouldn't except that speed on a FREE download server on my PC. I'd find a better one, but its the 360 so I can't. M$ need to see that its time to upgrade the capacities of the XBL network before it grinds to a halt(again). And yes media DLC is nice, but its advertising, and cross promotion. Its we the consumers that benefits the least(although it ain't that bad) in the content provider, M$ and Us stakes.

[TRIGGER M4N]

skate. is a load of old horse shit anyway.

[_Chris_]

Did kinda expect that, did noone notice the big 'EA' all over it?

[kobejonez]

skate. is a load of old horse shit anyway.

Bummed. But its sort of irrelevant what the demos like if its delivered at dial up speeds consistently. Just makes for unhappier campers.

[Jamzy No 2]

its only ever the 1st day when theres a prob downloading a demo but even so i didn't buy my 360 to play demos i bought it to play full games so i think ill survive if i have to wait abit for a demo.

[Thryon]

Bummed. But its sort of irrelevant what the demos like if its delivered at dial up speeds consistently. Just makes for unhappier campers.

Must be region specific. I downloaded skate in about 20 minutes last night, while playing Bioshock. I have yet to wait for any demo, everything downloads super fast.

[UKJAY]

My Email to MS Support Team on Friday August 3rd 2007

Hi

Recently I was made aware that all xbox360 consoles now have a three year warranty & that all the people who paid for repairs will get refunded.

Because I paid to have my xbox360 console repaired do you know when I will be getting a refund?

Thanks

Jason Andrews


My Reply on Wednesday August 22nd 2007

Dear Mr.Andrews
Thank you for your email. In order to respond effectively to your email we need to investigate further. Therefore please contact the Xbox Customer Support team

Kind Regards,
Rana
Xbox Support

[Thryon]

My Email to MS Support Team on Friday August 3rd 2007

Hi

Recently I was made aware that all xbox360 consoles now have a three year warranty & that all the people who paid for repairs will get refunded.

Because I paid to have my xbox360 console repaired do you know when I will be getting a refund?

Thanks

Jason Andrews


My Reply on Wednesday August 22nd 2007

Dear Mr.Andrews
Thank you for your email. In order to respond effectively to your email we need to investigate further. Therefore please contact the Xbox Customer Support team

Kind Regards,
Rana
Xbox Support


19 days to tell you to call em...classic _o_
This proves my theory that MS biggest problem is not the hardware, but the outsourcing of their Xbox 360 support division.

[mass9]

the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing.
Not uncommon in large corporations like MS, but still, almost 3 weeks to hear someone passing the buck is unacceptable.

[UKJAY]

Yes. Rana should have been burnt at the stake

[_Chris_]

So closed minded Jay, theres so many slower, more fun ways to kill people:)

[UKJAY]

I called MS Customer Support and they stated that there will be no refunds for people who paid to get their 360's fixed. Every console has new warranty but no one is getting money back ???

Does someone have a link which shows some form of official statement, has anyone else had money back???

[Jamzy No 2]

So closed minded Jay, theres so many slower, more fun ways to kill people:)

yes like... implanting shit up there nose while slowly peeling there skin of with a blunt knife and cut just below the testicles so it hurts like hell and slowly dies throw in a kick in the balls evrey few minutes then use a cheese grater on there buttocks slowly chop off limbs slowly 1 at a time but instead of choping of the left hand put it in a blender and have it shreaded then brand them with one of those rods they use to brand cows. lso make sure to remove all the teeth one at a time and finally fart in there face

[_Chris_]

I was thinking more along the lines of the Chinese water thing, drive them insane, then 1000 small cuts all over the body (takes hours, sometimes days to die), while cutting off the tip of each finger/toe, then (bare in mind the tipless fingers/toes and 1000 small cuts) a vinegar bath. And you cant forget clamps to the balls.

[Bleach22]

I like skate. tbh, I use to skate alot so because this is more realistic i find it more fun.

And, Xbox Customer Support are knobheads, absolute. fucking. knobheads.
Apart from the few nice people i've talked to, but tbh I dont know if im talking to someone nice now as I can't understand indian.

[max2663]

i e-mailed 360 support about my disc getting scratched when i put it in the 360 and they e-mailed me back an hour later telling me there had been no other complaints of this and therefore couldnt help me:'(

[UKJAY]

i e-mailed 360 support about my disc getting scratched when i put it in the 360 and they e-mailed me back an hour later telling me there had been no other complaints of this and therefore couldnt help me:'(

Try using lube next time.

[max2663]

haha

[UKJAY]

haha

My first 360 had that problem, my discs were badly scratched on the outer side and around the who disc. But scratched disc's I had to take up with the people that made them...in the leaflet is an address to send discs back to

[max2663]

it happened to my copy of pgr3 but then i got forza 2 so i wasnt too bothered about it,

[UKJAY]

For me it was PGR3, Tigerwoods 06 & NeedForSpeed: Most Wanted Twice.

Need for Speed Most Wanted is so thin it splits right down the middle.

[Bleach22]

my cod2 disc is split and my 360 sound like its going to vomit if i boot it up with that in the disc drive.